tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-969113154047000317.post3980968928465367704..comments2023-09-16T04:44:58.971-07:00Comments on Crit or Cruddy: 4E - Is change possible?Gamer Dudehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05006232842482959060noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-969113154047000317.post-76947783096406150102009-08-10T09:23:53.192-07:002009-08-10T09:23:53.192-07:00Well GamerDude I have already put fourth the issue...Well GamerDude I have already put fourth the issue hehe...I am removing the player based create magic item ritual as a whole. PC will have to go to other sources for items. Plus I have been thinking about having to find ways to identify items with out being a huge money/time sink for the players. So don't worry it is something I myself have been annoyed with. I have some good ideas on allowing PC's to quest a bit if they want to forge/create an item. I would like to make magic more "important" that way. Also...I am gonna kill off the Sunrod...hate that item soooooooo much. <br /><br />While I understand and in many ways agree with your "rumblings" As a DM there are a few things I can do to help not lose the moment. Predrawing/Having the maps ready to go on the fly is something I need to do. So hopefully that will lessen that level of frustration.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06462617561583212632noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-969113154047000317.post-49188403881061485392009-07-31T15:06:29.125-07:002009-07-31T15:06:29.125-07:00i'm a regular on the WotC website and we get n...i'm a regular on the WotC website and we get new players regularly asking for help on starting up (it's usually the vein of "3.5 or 4?") so i've accumulated a few "free stuff" links (still looking for pre-3rd stuff that isn't a derivative and actually D&D), which run the gamut from simple portraits (which you can download/scale/print on paper or cardstock), a printable grid, free modules and test rules (like the srd). <br /><br />i can point a player to enough resources that they don't need to buy anything other then the printer paper and ink, which i assume most people reading this post would have. heck if they have a laptop they don't even need physical dice.<br />----------------------<br />as for magic items and "fairness", the core game has a few assumptions, basically that each character should have items that give them +X to attack/defense (so a magic weapon, armor & amulet) where X is level /5 rounded to the nearest number.<br /><br />the rest is really up in air as to what toys they have. do what is right for your game, but throw the players a bone every now and then. <br /><br />kord knows i've had PCs (both that i've played and GMed for) who just sat on a cartoonishly large piles of money (ok, on a bag of holding...) because our adventuring/wandering and generally self-sufficient lifestyle needed little funding beyond trail rations and minor restocking of some tools.<br /><br />the last 2 editions have magic items built into the mechanics and are expected. if you're going to limit them, there needs to be some considerationsOxybenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-969113154047000317.post-25819102482842511662009-07-31T10:02:55.638-07:002009-07-31T10:02:55.638-07:00You don't want to play 4E. They want to play 4...You don't want to play 4E. They want to play 4E. I'm not sure you can get around this with a bunch of house rules. <br /><br />If I had a group that wanted to play 3E and I wanted to play 1E, I could ask them to toss out the skills, feats, and prestige classes. But then they're not really getting 3E anymore, right?<br /><br />As for the minis, I've gone so far as to make wargaming terrain and found that it was just a hassle. Too bulky to store anywhere, got in the way of line of sight, wasn't modular enough. I'm working on dungeon tiles right now that I'll have printed on cardstock and laminated. I'll put together enough of a variety that it won't impede creativity of the DM but it will make it so we don't have to draw so much on the wet-erase mat. <br /><br />Then again I recently ran a jailbreak without putting down minis once. It was all description and shared imagination. <br /><br />As for the magic items, I've come to feel that they should be weird and sometimes too powerful. But they should have drawbacks that make them not always the best choice. <br /><br />And really that the game world is not fair. Sometimes the monster has meager treasure, sometimes it has something really cool. Sometimes characters die. And I think the chance of both danger and great reward makes for better play than the players choosing which perfectly-balanced magic item the next ogre will drop.Tacomanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-969113154047000317.post-73848822878401899302009-07-31T08:12:49.401-07:002009-07-31T08:12:49.401-07:00Minis are insidious imagination-destroyers, but go...Minis are insidious imagination-destroyers, but good luck getting rid of them in 4E.<br /><br />The Chainmail excuse is common and completely bogus. D&D started out as Chainmail+, but when it became an RPG it became a different animal.<br /><br />Another way it's bogus is that the people advancing that argument don't <i>really</i> think that the way Chainmail did anything might be better and purer, they're just pushing that argument AGAINST people who don't like the way 3rd and 4th editions made it practically impossible to play BtB, without minis.<br /><br />It's hard for me to imagine that you really want to play 4E at all if you don't dig tactical combat or those class powers. What's really left after that?K. Baileyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06623767121412820113noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-969113154047000317.post-33058428769616405042009-07-30T14:07:40.461-07:002009-07-30T14:07:40.461-07:00Hey Oxybe,
I'll have to admit, miniatures wer...Hey Oxybe,<br /><br />I'll have to admit, miniatures were never part of our games all through Jr. High and High school. We did venture there a bit when we were in University...but like you, we didn't go overboard w/ the huge efforts of setting up massively detailed playing spaces and trying to find the "exact" right representatives. I've a feeling that most recent efforts have something to do with marketing though.<br /><br />I mean heck, if you've bought $100's, if not $1000's of dollars worth of minis and you're loathe not to utilize them at every given opportunity. (BTW, I'm not talking about me. I own a small bag full, maybe $30 worth...and that's it.)<br /><br />In so far as the "tapestry" thing goes, you're right of course. But, I have found that minis can be a bit of a distraction. A good example of this might be from a game that I run for my daughters. <br /><br />We had never utilized minis before, and one night I thought that I'd give it a whirl. All it did was distract the girls. They paid more attention to what was going on on the table and started to wander away from descriptions of things. It's was an extremely odd thing to see. So I just did away with them.<br /><br />Another good example is a game I ran with a couple of my pals recently. There was a series of battles in the old Moat House. We never used minis, and skimmed smoothly through three battles. We did use a piece of paper as a map though...and sort of jotted down X's and O's when things got too confusing. Fast and clean.<br /><br />I guess I'm just not a fan. I mean, I have been in games before where minis didn't take center stage. But they were few and far between. I kind of like your idea. Or even dice, for the monsters...I remember doing a LOT of that in University. Abstraction's a good thing. I'm not looking for a realistic war game.<br /><br />As for the magic items, I love your idea. I was thinking of suggesting something similar to either the old elemental rings in AD&D (e.g. Ring of Air Elemental Control) or maybe the legendary weapons dealio that scaled with their owners from 3E. (I can't remember the name of the book where this was introduced though, my bad.)<br /><br />Anything to get away from the cookie-cutter approach to magic items would be great. That's absolutely something I missed from earlier additions. There's just no magic in magic items anymore. IMHO of course.Gamer Dudehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05006232842482959060noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-969113154047000317.post-7526543097044119832009-07-30T13:25:47.023-07:002009-07-30T13:25:47.023-07:00minis in combat:
i've always used them, if on...minis in combat:<br /><br />i've always used them, if only to help adjudicate who's in the room when the fireball goes off. <br /><br />i rarely do combat where it's party VS single monster in boring 20x20 room. if there is a single monster, it's a guard and either he gets away and calls backup or is obliterated by the party.<br /><br />the problem with the "rich tapestry of the mind" is that not everyone is always looking at the same tapestry, which can cause problems.<br /><br />minis are not supposed to be a substitute but a compliment. it's there to show where everyone is and what's going on. we have a minimalist approach to minis. each player has one that resembles their character and for the monsters we have a few stock figs (generic kobolds, orcs, fighters, archers, wizards, whatever) that we whip out. the whole setup is hardly time consuming. rolling initiative is slower then the setup. heck we keep our dry-erase mat out at all times as a giant coaster for our pop & munchies :D <br /><br />to each his or her own though. i never felt that minis hurt the game and i use them in almost all RPGs i play, if only to let people know where everyone is.<br /><br />-------------------------<br /><br />for the magic items? <br /><br />i say strip away the plusses and make them inherent to the character. to balance this out all characters get a natural +1 to their attacks, damage and defenses at levels 3/8/13/18/23/28.<br /><br />the main difference between a "longsword" and a generic "magic longsword" is that the magic one adds the bonus damage to the crit.<br /><br />instead of a "+3 flaming longsword" you just have a "flaming longsword" who's + value will vary with character's inherent bonus. <br /><br />now the main bonus to this method is that it destroys the need to always upgrade your weapons. indeed, your items' will become better as your character becomes stronger. you can keep your father's "flaming longsword" throughout your career without worry as it will always be as useful as you need it.<br /><br />as for making them unique, one can take a hint from the artifact rules. each artifact has a sliding scale on how "happy" is (ok, i don't know what the exact word is but it's basically that), and by meeting various requirements you can make it happier and thus unlock extra abilities. some are one time requirements with big payoffs, others are small payoffs but repeatable.<br /><br />for our friend the flaming longsword, this could be akin to dipping it into the core of a long active volcano (as a one time bonus), destroying powerful water elementals, having it blessed by a powerful efreet in the city of brass, ect...<br /><br />flaming shockwaves, hurling fireballs, ect... could all be extra abilities gained by making the sword "happier"<br /><br />of course the artifacts still have more awesome abilities but it's something to consider.<br /><br />same with magic armor, amulets, ect... the happier you make it, the more thematically appropriate abilities you could add.Oxybenoreply@blogger.com